‘I find it exciting, but we are just going to do it!’

Just imagine that you did not take this master’s programme – MBA Imagineering – after your bachelor’s programme. What would you have done differently in your job now?

‘Gee, that’s a tough one. What I do know – now that I’ve worked for a couple of years – is that it was the right choice. In the master’s programme there’s a focus on the other perspective. How to bring about change from the community and not from a single CEO or manager. I often see in the facilities domain that the distance between those two worlds is quite large; someone from management often has no idea what’s going on on the shop floor. The perception is different. I learned how to reduce that distance. In that sense, the master’s programme really added something for me.’ 

Denice van Dijk works at Facilicom Solutions in Schiedam. In her role as a change manager she is involved in large change management projects. Last year, she liaised with the municipality of Rotterdam to support them in making Rotterdam residents more central within the Work & Income cluster with the aid of an IT implementation. And she is currently working on a project for the COA (Central Body for Asylum Seekers), helping security guards with a new way of registering incidents.

‘Every project is different,’ Denice says. ‘In every organisation, you have an upper current and an undercurrent. Nothing is what it seems, so you have to start looking for things. Where is their resistance, where is their pain? You start talking to people and need to be able to ask the right questions. I spent a day with an activation coach in Rotterdam. This is someone who talks to job seekers to coach them towards volunteer work or to help them become part of society again. Incredibly great work, and especially feeling that different perspective made a big impression on me. Being able to empathise with others is so important in this profession.’

So developing empathic ability? Did you learn that in the MBA Imagineering?

‘The master’s programme indeed focuses very much on personal development. But even in the bachelor’s programme, self-reflection and getting to know yourself better was hammered at. You need that basis to be able to look at things from a different perspective. I once opted for Facility Management because I thought I was good at organising, but I’m not that blue at all!’ (laughs)

Blue in the sense of structured, having control?

‘Exactly, that has been mostly to the credit of the programme. In my experience, the bachelor’s programme often addressed KPIs and SLAs. Super important, of course, but it wasn’t until in the master’s programme that for me the human aspect came more into view. Green and yellow, so to speak. And so everything comes together; I’m becoming more and more of a well-rounded person. I did figure skating at a high level for years, so I was red anyway. Results-oriented, goal-oriented, just about everything had to give way.’

How did that shape you?

‘I mostly learned to fail.’

That’s how it really felt?

‘You’ve failed when you fall, literally, haven’t you? I failed, I thought then, but I have to get back on the ice tomorrow. Goal setting and perseverance alone won’t get you there. Support is important. That’s why I started a business in coaching. I helped children on their way to a career in top sports. It worked, and do you know why? I had an empathetic approach. More so than others. From the start of this business I started to develop myself more consciously. I always thought I was a doer – I had nothing to do with models and theories – but I discovered that I’m primarily a thinker. I love exploring the complexity of change processes.’

And that started with the chaos theory and lecturer Joseph Roevens?   

‘I was his research assistant in the final year of my bachelor’s programme. He worked on a study – and also wrote a book – on Organize with Chaos. I remember him talking about a burned tree that, through its natural ash, provides fertile ground from which something new can blossom. Sometimes it’s good to let something bleed to death for the purpose of making room for other ideas. That digging, and figuring out what has a chance to flourish, that’s what I liked. I wanted to know more about it. And that’s what eventually made me choose the MBA Imagineering.’

So going for models and theories after all?

‘Especially tools that help you gain more insight. Change processes are complex. You have to figure out the lay of the land, who should talk to whom and who has influence. What are undercurrents, what are people sensitive to, how do you get them engaged in the change process. But at the end of the day, the main thing is to keep repeating the why. It’s going to be a long haul.’

You always went for it! As an ex-athlete who still works out five days a week. What makes you feel out of sorts?

‘I don’t allow myself to feel out of sorts that easily, but sometimes I do get upset when I’ve started running too fast.’ (laughs) ‘I can’t right now because I’m on crutches, I have a tear in my meniscus... But seriously, when I’ve thought of something that turns out not to work after all, it feels like failure and falling on the ice again for a while. Fortunately, I know how to deal with it.’

Is it often running?

‘Usually it is. You always have a deadline. Change takes not only time, but also money, so it would be better if such a process doesn’t take too long. But I like running! It is enormously satisfying when you can achieve something together. When people say: OK, I find it exciting, but you’ve informed us well, so we’re just going to do it! That feels so good!’

About the MBA Imagineering

In the one-year programme of this professional master’s programme you will learn to innovate from a people-oriented perspective. You will learn how to make people co-design their own story or that of their organisation by using imagination. Innovating and changing by strengthening collective creativity, that is the core of this MBA programme at Breda University of Applied Sciences. There is also an executive variant, which lasts eighteen months.

Link to MBA Imagineering master programmes.

Interview: Maaike Dukker-’t Hart